When did you give up on Matt Rhule?

[CanePantherHornet]

12 minutes ago, WOW!! said:

We've have truly become the Cardinals and Browns fan base.. Without all the loyalty... Atleast they show up even when they lose... But firing coaches after a year is stupid..

I bet Browns and Cardinals fans are very happy they let go Wilks and Kitchens considering how much those teams have improved.

I'm not 100% sure it needs to be Rhule, but I think Brady definitely needs to go. Fire him now and hand it over to Sean Ryan for the rest of the year.

[rippadonn]

In over his head. When Hurney offered to move mountains and go get Rhule Justin Herbert and Rhule was like, nah, we good, I knew he didn't understand the NFL.

Hurney was a 1st round savant who blessed Ron with a long career by being the GM who drafted Cam when many others claimed they wouldn't.

Mac Jones or my guy Kyle Trask would have at least given Rhule a net, in that rookies need time to develop.

Rhule continues to think QB is just a guy. As we know only having 2-3 franchise QBs in our whole history, your QB IS the guy and your first priority.

 

[LinvilleGorge]

3 minutes ago, rippadonn said:

In over his head. When Hurney offered to move mountains and go get Rhule Justin Herbert and Rhule was like, nah, we good, I knew he didn't understand the NFL.

Hurney was a 1st round savant who blessed Ron with a long career by being the GM who drafted Cam when many others claimed they wouldn't.

Mac Jones or my guy Kyle Trask would have at least given Rhule a net, in that rookies need time to develop.

Rhule continues to think QB is just a guy. As we know only having 2-3 franchise QBs in our whole history, your QB IS the guy and your first priority.

 

Rhule's teams have always been built around dominant D and decent offense. He thought he could replicate that in the NFL. Put all the resources into the D, find a JAG vet QB to hold the fort down and let boy wonder Brady go to work. Well, it doesn't work like that in the NFL and it's alarming Rhule couldn't see that coming in.

[KSpan]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Rhule's teams have always been built around dominant D and decent offense. He thought he could replicate that in the NFL. Put all the resources into the D, find a JAG vet QB to hold the fort down and let boy wonder Brady go to work. Well, it doesn't work like that in the NFL and it's alarming Rhule couldn't see that coming in.

Agreed. It can work (see Ravens w/ Dilfer, Bucs w/ Johnson, Broncos w/ husk of Manning), but it's so very rare given the parity in the league and omnipresent chances of injury that it's shortsighted at best and foolish at worst to have that be a primary strategy. This was the crux of many a discussion around the Teddy signing last year... lo and behold, the defense-centric lotto ticket hasn't cashed out.

[CRA]

Most recent Super Bowl Champs (minus the Patriots) 

Bucs - coach prior to the SB winning coach lasted 2 years 

KC - coach prior to the Super Bowl winning coach lasted 1 year 

Philly - coach prior lasted 1 year 

Denver - coach prior lasted 1 year 

Seattle - coach prior lasted 1 year 

Its not just the Browns that part from coaches that don’t work.  You part with coaches that don’t work.  You stick with coaches that give you a reason to….until they don’t.  Not For Long league applies to coaches too 

[CanePantherHornet]

3 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Rhule's teams have always been built around dominant D and decent offense. He thought he could replicate that in the NFL. Put all the resources into the D, find a JAG vet QB to hold the fort down and let boy wonder Brady go to work. Well, it doesn't work like that in the NFL and it's alarming Rhule couldn't see that coming in.

I mean, in his defense, even if it was a JAG at QB, the offense should not be shitting the bed as much as it has. The offense with this many weapons should not be this bad even if Nathan Peterman was under center. 

[LinvilleGorge]

1 minute ago, KSpan said:

Agreed. It can work (see Ravens w/ Dilfer, Bucs w/ Johnson, Broncos w/ husk of Manning), but it's so very rare given the parity in the league and omnipresent chances of injury that it's shortsighted at best and foolish at worst to have that be a primary strategy. This was the crux of many a discussion around the Teddy signing last year... lo and behold, the defense-centric lotto ticket hasn't cashed out.

Those Ravens and Bucs teams were prior to the change in interpretation of illegal contact. That changed the game that was when the league started to evolve full on pass happy.

 

[WOW!!]

This is a dumb conversation and a overarching after a horrible lose...

If you're done with Rhule.. You might want to take 2 years off because he's here for Atleast 2 more years.. Sorry .. But Tepper is from the Steelers system and they don't fire coaches after 1 season..

[Day1PanthersFan]

The day it was announced that we signed Baylors coach 

 

[BIGH2001]

5 hours ago, CRA said:

Most recent Super Bowl Champs (minus the Patriots) 

Bucs - coach prior to the SB winning coach lasted 2 years 

KC - coach prior to the Super Bowl winning coach lasted 1 year 

Philly - coach prior lasted 1 year 

Denver - coach prior lasted 1 year 

Seattle - coach prior lasted 1 year 

Its not just the Browns that part from coaches that don’t work.  You part with coaches that don’t work.  You stick with coaches that give you a reason to….until they don’t.  Not For Long league applies to coaches too 

Exactly. The NFL is a week to week and year to year league. It’s not college where you and everyone else pretty much have a core group for 3-4 years after you recruit them. If it’s not working then you start over until you find the right formula. There is no 3,5 or 7 year “process.” You can be good one season and awful the next and vice versa. The teams that suck year in and year out are under constantly bad management who choose bad head coaches/staff and draft poorly. 
 

im more than a little concerned that we have a management problem which is a lot harder to fix than a coach problem. Rhule isn’t it and needs to be gone. Then our GM needs to find a way to acquire Watson or evaluate the best rookie QB next year and draft him. Everyone and everything else is pretty much a dime a dozen (including interior linemen) and can be built through free agency and lower round draft picks.

TLDR Rhule is an idiot who is treating this franchise like a college program which is not how you win in the NFL. 

Edited October 25, 2021 by BIGH2001

[Khyber53]

8 hours ago, electro's horse said:

tools to fix the team aren't on it

sam was always the third option at QB, things just didn't work out. Injuries have hampered things, Brady has fallen to earth, etc. it's gone pear shaped; there's nothing that can be done. 

if you wanna blame him for how bad the offense is you have to give him credit for how good the defense is

The defense isn't that good. Hasn't been since week four. They just gave up 23 points (two were the offense's fault directly) to the hapless Giants. They moved on our defense pretty much at will (well, for the Giants that was at will). 

HC, OC, DC, STC are all basically mid-tier college football guys and that's where they should have stayed. 

New GM was a mid-level scouting dude for a team that drafted well a couple of times nearly a decade ago and have been falling apart since. He's out of his element and cannot evaluate talent, especially under Rhule's guidance.

The tools for fixing this team aren't in the coaches offices or front office, either. And the owner is just a self-possessed, bloviated tyro who wants to grab his trophy wife's ass at press conferences. 

[SCO96]

7 hours ago, Knaakedup said:

Please provide any information to support “year 3 is usually the year for coaches”. That’s completely fabricated just to support your support for him. If a coach doesn’t turn things around year 1/2, they’re usually out the door. 
 

edit: maybe due to the dumb contract we gave him, year 3 would make sense ***IF things were trending in the right direction which they clearly are not

Year three isn’t always a “the year” for a head coach, but there is some historical precedent for the statement.
 

Bill Walsh took over the 49ers in 1979. He started with a 2-14 season. By the end of the 1981 season they won the first of their four Super Bowls in the 1980s.

Jimmy Johnson took over the Cowboys in 1989. He started 1-15. In his third year they had their first winning season and made the playoffs. They won back to back titles in 1992-1993 and third title in 1995.

Walsh and Johnson’s teams were so good that the last titles their teams  won were done so without either guy coaching the team. Walsh resigned and George Seifert took over. Jimmy was “let go” and replaced by Barry Switzer.

The problem seems to be that Rhule doesn’t really seem (at least so far) to be a great HC like the above 2 guys. Bill Walsh was an offensive genius. Jimmy could spot talent a mile away and figured out pretty quickly that physically imposing offensive lines win games in the NFL.

His biggest blunder was the 2nd round of the 2021 draft. He and Fitterer passed on 6 offensive tackles and 3 interior lineman to draft a WR who has not made us any better, even though the oline was a weak link on the team. I think we traded down over 20 slots to pick TMJ when either of the guys we passed would have made our  OLine better immediately. Then we draft a LT in the 3rd round that he views as a 2nd round guard LG in the NFL. If you’re that sure he’s a guard, then you should have drafted a tackle or a center( the best center in the draft was on the board before we moved down) in round 2 and picked BC in round 3. You’d have at least improved 40% of the line in two rounds.

 

 

 

[TheRumGone]

18 minutes ago, Khyber53 said:

The defense isn't that good. Hasn't been since week four. They just gave up 23 points (two were the offense's fault directly) to the hapless Giants. They moved on our defense pretty much at will (well, for the Giants that was at will). 

The defense is actually really fuging good and I stand by my statement that it’s a championship type defense and they are extremely young. Some of y’all do not understand how insanely bad offenses have an affect on a defense. When your offense turns the ball over 2 to 3 times a game and can’t sustain drives you cannot expect a defense to hold all game. Those championship caliber defenses that won Super Bowls had strong run games and methodical offenses. Seattle, Ravens, ect s. They don’t turn the ball over, they sustain drives to keep that defense fresh. You cannot do what this offense is doing and expect them to be dominant. It’s complimentary football. You put someone like DW caliber of quarterbacking on this team and it changes over night.

[SCO96]

2 minutes ago, TheRumGone said:

The defense is actually really fuging good and I stand by my statement that it’s a championship type defense and they are extremely young. Some of y’all do not understand how insanely bad offenses have an affect on a defense. When your offense turns the ball over 2 to 3 times a game and can’t sustain drives you cannot expect a defense to hold all game. Those championship caliber defenses that won Super Bowls had strong run games and methodical offenses. Seattle, Ravens, ect s. They don’t turn the ball over, they sustain drives to keep that defense fresh. You cannot do what this offense is doing and expect them to be dominant. It’s complimentary football. You put someone like DW caliber of quarterbacking on this team and it changes over night.

I think the announcers said yesterday that we had EIGHT 3 and out drives yesterday. That’s terrible when you consider team average about 12 possessions a game.  Our defense is on the field too long. They are having to support an offense that literally cannot score points in the 3rd quarter. It’s too early to go into a full panic mode, but getting rid of our OC would be a justifiable move at this point. Thing is, I don’t think we have another viable option on the staff right now.