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Sean Ryan on key Darnold improvement (P-Wire's Rizzuti) & my $0.02

top dawg

By top dawg,
in Carolina Panthers

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NAS Grand Master

NAS

Posted
Posted
59 minutes ago, pantherclaw said:

Yeah, he never become the the best he could have been. 

He had the talent to be the best to ever play the game. 

Prior to last year, Josh Allen looked like a bust, but he made a significant jump and was an MVP candidate.

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CRA Grand Master

CRA

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21 minutes ago, Tr3ach said:

Some qbs definitely improve at the pro level. 

 yeah, I have never argued that they don't.

I'm arguing you don't change their DNA.   You aren't going to be able to coach ice water into David Carr's veins while in the pocket.   You got it or you don't.  You aren't going to be able to coach that crazy ball out of Favre.    You aren't going to coach Cam into playing it safe with his body when he thinks the team really needs the play.  

and if someone is a poor decision maker, hesitant, etc.....you aren't going to change that IMO 4 years into a NFL career.  It's been there too long. 

 

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PhillyB Grand Master

PhillyB

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2 hours ago, OldhamA said:

Part of the reason I never fell in love with Newton (pre or post Draft) was because his mechanics sucked.

He got by on sheer talent. He improved as a player, but he never made that quantum leap that Rodgers expected him to (after he played against us when Newton was a rookie, Rodgers said he was glad that the Packers were playing us now rather than when Newton made the leap).

It seems like Darnold is more coachable so far, but I agree the test will be when the pocket starts collapsing during the season.

imagine watching five years of cam's progression from struggling as a rookie with a great offensive line and steve smith as a wideout to carrying the team to a super bowl with a poo line and ted fuging ginn and suggesting cam wasn't coachable or didn't make a quantum leap lmao

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Ghostface Chilla Rising Star

Ghostface Chilla

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I'm excited to see Sam play for the Panthers. As an SC (Trojans) fan, I watched his entire college career and we had some really great and exciting games under the bright lights, such as the Rose Bowl game against Penn St. When I lived in the Carolinas from 2015-2019, I was always wondering how Sam would look with the Panthers. When Carolina traded for him, I was pumped to say the least. Granted, his NFL start with the Jets was not going well, I have faith that he can be great with an organization like the Panthers. 

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glenwo2 Grand Master

glenwo2

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If it's "coach speak", why make this thread and post the article at all then?  🤷‍♂️

 

I mean...what Sean said wasn't wrong at all.   Footwork is essential to be able to throw accurate passes and what-not.

IMO, it just seems as if some people here just don't want Sam to be successful because they wanted Justin Fields and are throwing a tantrum like little kids.

Edited by glenwo2
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Tr3ach Grand Master

Tr3ach

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1 hour ago, CRA said:

 yeah, I have never argued that they don't.

I'm arguing you don't change their DNA.   You aren't going to be able to coach ice water into David Carr's veins while in the pocket.   You got it or you don't.  You aren't going to be able to coach that crazy ball out of Favre.    You aren't going to coach Cam into playing it safe with his body when he thinks the team really needs the play.  

and if someone is a poor decision maker, hesitant, etc.....you aren't going to change that IMO 4 years into a NFL career.  It's been there too long. 

 

Maybe not but I wouldnt say its impossible.   I feel like decision making is a trait that's a lot different than the others you mentioned.   I feel like decision making can be helped by scheme and even just the way the quarterback makes their roads.  Starting by simplifying the decisions you're asking the qb to make and building from there.

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Rocky Davis Veteran

Rocky Davis

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2 hours ago, PhillyB said:

imagine watching five years of cam's progression from struggling as a rookie with a great offensive line and steve smith as a wideout to carrying the team to a super bowl with a poo line and ted fuging ginn and suggesting cam wasn't coachable or didn't make a quantum leap lmao

I am not going to disagree that Cam carried that team on his back, but it was still the same Cam as the previous seasons. 

Cam always relied on his extraordinary athleticism and never really changed his mechanics as a QB.  With all the pounding and abuse he took under Ron and Co. he was never going to do that forever and as we saw when the injuries started piling up Cam wasn't able to carry the team or any team with his freak athleticism any longer.  He never "grew" into a prototypical NFL quarterback and his mechanics never fundamentally changed.....there was always reversion back to his natural instincts.  This can be blamed on two things in my opinion:  1.) Cam was who he was and there was no way to really change what was ingrained in him over 20+ years and 2.) to be able to make that sort of change as a QB you have to have protection and time to gain confidence that the change being asked for is possible...he never had that!  Personally I think it was a combo of the two.

Are we going to see the same with Darnold?  I think the answer lies in if we ever give him the protection and peace of mind that Cam never had.  I think there's a better chance of a change with Darnold, but without a solid O-line he'll revert to running around slinging it trying to make plays. 

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