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The Watson Thread - Part Deux


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1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, I mean I think Watson is better too but I am more so playing the devils advocate of why it might not be a great idea to expend all these resources on a guy that really still isn't a completely proven commodity. 

Hence the core of my counter argument about the price. Stafford and Wilson were PROVEN commodities. Time tested. Watson just isn't.

I won't argue against the talent level, that is obvious.

I think if Watson was in his 30's like both Stafford and Wilson are. The price wouldn't be as much. 

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Just now, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, I mean I think Watson is better too but I am more so playing the devils advocate of why it might not be a great idea to expand all these resources on a guy that really still isn't a completely proven commodity. 

Hence the core of my counter argument about the price. Stafford and Wilson were PROVEN commodities. Time tested. Watson just isn't.

I won't argue against the talent level, that is obvious.

Stafford was tested against what? He went to three playoff games in 12 years with Detroit. If anything, there were more questions about him than Watson. Watson accomplished as much as Stafford from 2009-2020, if not more, within 4 years.

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Just now, Carl Spackler said:

I advocate holding onto the best running back in the NFL, a multi-position All-Pro player who's been healthy since Christmas and was held out to tank. But for a good price (an actually good one, not a second-round pick Rhule will use on some loser he recruited), I would be willing to part with most any non-Burns or Moore player. 

I want a plan in place that offsets the recent stupidity. I want to extend Moore, fortify the offensive line, and fire Matt Rhule. I want to keep Brian Burns, a Pro Bowl DE on a rookie contract, and I want to add a run-stuffing DT in the draft. 

The stuff about holding CMC out is fan speculation. There is a truth we know even if you do not want to admit it. He is not the do all offensive piece you or the coaches have hoped for. Having the best RB cannot make up for not having a franchise QB. I'd like those things you mention too but I don't think it all happens together with a franchise QB. By the time we back our way into one the core will either be aged out or sign elsewhere. You can't just wait around hoping the next franchise QB will fall into your lap. Either you just suck and draft one every year or you make a move when one becomes available which is not often. That's where we're at 🤷‍♂️

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Just now, Smittymoose said:

Stafford was tested against what? He went to three playoff games in 12 years with Detroit. If anything, there were more questions about him than Watson. Watson accomplished as much as Stafford from 2009-2020, if not more, within 4 years.

Lol. No he didn't but believe what you want.

1 minute ago, NCTHFL0567 said:

I think if Watson was in his 30's like both Stafford and Wilson are. The price wouldn't be as much. 

We will see. Whether he ends up here or not, the final price will be interesting.

How about this scenario, New Orleans and us get in a bidding war and Tepper gives up 4 1st rounders and some change because he doesn't want his guy to get away. Is that too much?

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3 hours ago, TheRumGone said:

The browns have everything he wants though. Great line, good coach, good defense. That was the wildcard team some people were worried about. The Texans do have a little power here where they can say “here these are the teams with the best packages you can waive your ntc” and that could exclude the browns, because they are an AFC team.

last I read their package was really weak. Like 2 1sts 2 2nds mayfield and one other player. Maybe they upped it idk.

I’d laugh my ass off if he chose Cleveland.

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30 minutes ago, Verge said:

Expect a decision today. If that wasn't obvious already.

x.png.ec602fefd0a19a8c724b5a3941fb43ed.png

 

Not trying to be that guy, but you have zero credibility. Beyond just having no check, nobody serious about this field is going to put their pronouns/gender in their description/bio. You're a Panthers fan on the opposite side of the country? Must have some good sources out there with those Bills fans. You write for a Panther-themed 'website', but immediately separate your opinions/takes from them. You put out insider information that apparently not even Schefter has, and yet you claim you aren't a source? And then you put it out there? Surprised nobody's called out all the contradictions when your twitter feed is loaded with "Could, potentially, may," etc. Clearly words distancing yourself from the blowback if you're wrong.

"This is entirely made up, in case you couldn't tell. Confirmed it not to be the case." Not a source?

"I do not have any info on Watson right now. I will update you when I do." Not a source?

"The feeling in the Carolina building was described to me as "optimistic"." Not a source?

x2.png.2e7037adbdde47fea4943cb65d536376.png Not a source?

There's a ton more, too. You can't not be a source and report 'insider information. Smells fishy.
 

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    • The referee assigned to this game is Shawn Smith. This is a critical data point for betting purposes because his crew has one of the most distinct, long-term statistical biases in the NFL. "Road Team" Bias: Historically, Shawn Smith is known as the "Road Team Referee." In a league where home teams usually win ~55% of the time, home teams in Smith's games have historically won at a rate far below league average (often hovering around 40-42%). Against The Spread (ATS): The trend is even starker here. Home teams have covered the spread at a rate of roughly 37-40% in his career. The Mechanism: Analysis shows his crew tends to call a higher rate of False Start and Unnecessary Roughness penalties on the Home Team. This negates the traditional home-field advantage (crowd noise causing false starts for the visitors). Impact on This Game: This specific assignment heavily favors the Buccaneers (Road Team). If you believe the referee influences the game, Smith's presence suggests the Panthers will struggle to get "home cooking" calls and may face untimely procedural flags that stall drives. The Panthers have only had Shawn Smith officiate four home games since he became a head referee in 2018, and they are all losses. Date Opponent Result Score Nov 24, 2024 vs. Kansas City Chiefs Loss 27–30 Oct 9, 2022 vs. San Francisco 49ers Loss 15–37 Dec 12, 2021 vs. Atlanta Falcons Loss 21–29 Nov 25, 2018 vs. Seattle Seahawks Loss 27–30 Considering the how rare it is for Shawn Smith to officiate a Panthers game at all, this seems like an odd time to assign him to a Panthers game, unless the NFL wants to kill the Panthers season once and for all.  The Panthers' offensive line situation creates a "perfect storm" for referee Shawn Smith's specific tendency to call False Starts on the home team. The "Carousel" Factor (Communication Vulnerability) The most damning stat for the Panthers' offensive line in 2025 is their lack of continuity. The Stat: By Week 13, the Panthers had already fielded their 10th different offensive line combination. The Impact: False starts are often "communication penalties"—they happen when a guard doesn't hear the center's snap count or a tackle anticipates the wrong cadence. A unit that hasn't played together struggles with non-verbal communication. The Shawn Smith Multiplier: Shawn Smith’s crew calls False Starts at a high rate on home teams. He will likely look for flinches on the exterior of the line. A disjointed line that is constantly rotating players (due to the injuries of starters like Cade Mays and the illness issues with Robert Hunt earlier this season) is "fresh meat" for this specific referee bias. The Specific Culprits (2025 Penalties) Ikem Ekwonu (LT): Leads the team with 4 False Start penalties this season. He is the most frequent violator on the line. Taylor Moton (RT): Has been flagged for 3 False Starts. The Trap: Smith’s crew often focuses on the tackles (the players furthest from the ball) jumping early to get an edge on speed rushers. Since Ekwonu struggles with this discipline naturally, having a referee who hunts for it is a massive disadvantage. The "Managed Outcome" Synthesis The "Bucs Cover" Script: If the desired outcome is a Buccaneers win to solidify their playoff standing, the officials simply have to apply the letter of the law. Calling strict False Starts on a confused, banged-up Panthers O-line will consistently put them in "3rd and Long" situations, killing their drives and allowing the Bucs (-3.5) to cover easily. The "Close Game" Script: If the desired outcome is "Week 18 Drama" (keeping the division tied), look for the officials to ignore the Panthers' twitchy tackles. If Ekwonu jumps a split-second early and no flag is thrown, it effectively neutralizes the Bucs' pass rush, allowing the Panthers to keep the score close. Summary of the Edge Vulnerability: Extreme. The Panthers are playing backup interior linemen (like Jake Curhan or practice squad call-ups) next to jumpy tackles. Betting Implication: This strongly reinforces the Bucs -3 or -3.5 play. The combination of a "Road Team Referee" and a "Home Team O-Line in chaos" suggests the Panthers will beat themselves with procedural penalties. Based on the collision of the hard data (Referee bias + Offensive Line injuries) and the soft narratives ("Managed Outcomes"), here is the definitive recommendation. If you have to place a single Moneyline bet to win this game straight up: The Pick: Tampa Bay Buccaneers (-165) While the "Entertainment Script" hints at a Panthers upset to keep the division messy, the structural disadvantage the Panthers face in this specific matchup is too massive to ignore. Here is why the Buccaneers are the stong moneyline play: 1. The "Shawn Smith" Road-Field Advantage This is the decisive factor. In the NFL, Home Field Advantage usually accounts for about 1.5 to 2 points of value. The Reality: Referee Shawn Smith negates that advantage entirely. His crew calls penalties in a way that historically suppresses home crowd momentum (False Starts, holding). The Result: You are essentially getting the Buccaneers on a neutral field (or even a "pseudo-home" field) against a team with a worse roster. 2. The "Drive-Killer" Synergy To win as an underdog, the Panthers need to play a clean, mistake-free game to keep drives alive. The combination of Panthers' 10th O-Line combo + Jump-prone Tackles (Ekwonu) + A Referee who hunts False Starts is a recipe for disaster. The Scenario: Expect the Panthers to face multiple "1st and 15" or "3rd and 12" situations due to procedural flags. These drive-killers will force them to punt or settle for field goals, while the Bucs' offense (led by Mayfield) stays on schedule. 3. The "TV Product" Counter-Argument You asked about the "Managed Outcome." While a Panthers win creates "chaos," the NFL also values Star Power in the playoffs. Baker Mayfield and the Buccaneers are a proven national TV draw with recent playoff history. If the league has to choose between "Chaos" (Panthers) and "Ratings/Legitimacy" (Bucs), the "Script" likely leans toward ensuring the Buccaneers—the more marketable team—secure the division lead. They won't "fix" the game against the Panthers, but they won't intervene to save them from their own penalties. Final Verdict Betting on the Panthers requires you to hope for a miracle 4th-quarter collapse. Betting on the Buccaneers requires you to trust that a superior roster—aided by a favorable officiating crew—will control the game for the first 45 minutes. Take the Buccaneers Moneyline. The "Safe" money is on the Ref. The Prediction: Tampa Bay Buccaneers Win and Cover Projected Score: Buccaneers 27, Panthers 17 The Bet: Buccaneers -3 (or Moneyline -165) Confidence Level: High on the Winner; Moderate on the Spread (due to potential "garbage time" variance).
    • He isn't a good HC. I think he has proved that conclusively.
    • The missed tackle percentage is on that screen cap.
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