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QB breakdowns by Josh McCown

Martin

By Martin,
in Carolina Panthers

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Basbear Grand Master

Basbear

Posted
Posted
23 hours ago, Jon Snow said:

Do you mean reality stuff? This is Frank Reich's career and reputation on the line. Josh will get to voice his opinion I'm sure. But the loudest voices in the room are Reich and Fitterer.  

I know its not popular, just being me. Josh has never done this job before, you could point to his 19(?) years playing QB and say he has. SOmewhat...... I point at ricky prohel, whom had a similar long career in many roles just like Josh. I thought ricky would do great............. turns out he couldnt get to authoritarian side of being a coach and wanted to be the rooms buddies. Its different when you need to have enforce standards and discipline, but you can not since youre in "friend/buddy" mode.  

There have been all sort of reports form texans wanting to name Josh HC to eagles begging him to be QB coach. Many speak highly, just this is his first year. Its a grid too, but I think his best asset is understanding how to reach "modern" players...... which in itself is a whole another issue. 

Heat is on.......Glad Josh is on the staff, have to see how this plays out...

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stan786 Mentor

stan786

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46 minutes ago, Buckeye Homer said:

He suffered a shoulder injury after getting hit while running the ball against Arkansas last season and had to leave the game and I believe he missed a start thereafter.  Young is a better athlete but Stroud is the better QB.  

His injury was more of a weird fall when trying to get the ball off getting pushed out on the sideline, kinda reminded me of the time cam first got hurt against the chargers when he just feel on his arm at a weird angle.

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Wes21 Mentor

Wes21

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Posted

He definitely felt like he could easily coach Bryce and CJ.  So I love that.  It seemed like he feels he could jump directly into the finer points of QB play with Bryce while the only real fundamental problem he would have to fix with CJ is keeping 2 hands on the ball.

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rayzor Grand Master

rayzor

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On 3/11/2023 at 8:01 AM, Jon Snow said:

You guys do realize that McCown does not get to pick our qb right? 

He doesn't, but if they are looking at three guys or whatever and he says, "you really don't want to push your chips all in on this guy" then they probably should listen.

Same with any of the rest of the coaching staff/position assistants for a particular position they are looking at. 

With McCown, he's been around long enough, in enough situations, and with a large sample of good and bad QBs over his very long career that you've got to think he knows his poo.

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Jon Snow Grand Master

Jon Snow

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, rayzor said:

He doesn't, but if they are looking at three guys or whatever and he says, "you really don't want to push your chips all in on this guy" then they probably should listen.

Same with any of the rest of the coaching staff/position assistants for a particular position they are looking at. 

With McCown, he's been around long enough, in enough situations, and with a large sample of good and bad QBs over his very long career that you've got to think he knows his poo.

I never suggested that he didn't know his poo. I'm saying he doesn't get to decide who's selected.  I think Frank knows a thing or two about qb's himself.  He and Fitterer are the only two that make the final decision. I think ultimately it will be Fitterer and Tepper who decide which QB is taken. 

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amcoolio Veteran

amcoolio

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Posted

CJ is very similar to Dak Prescott. If we take him the coaching staff thinks they can improve his intangibles to a tier above. 

With Young I see a lot of Russell Wilson and Mahomes, it's obvious he's influenced by them. But he's just really small. Russ was built and Mahomes is much taller.

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Luciu5 Veteran

Luciu5

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Buckeye Homer said:

Young is a better athlete but Stroud is the better QB.  

I wouldn't say that. I've watched a bunch of both and to me Young can do things that Stroud either can't or won't. Some of the throws he makes, it's like you can't teach that. Full field reads. Not just one play, but all over his tape. Hardly any of that in Stroud's tape. Young is the clear cut number one QB in this draft without any question, if it wasn't for his size.

All that said, Stroud is no slouch and wouldn't mind him, but Young is the safer pick in a lot of respects, besides size. Stroud struggles with pressure, which Young just avoids it easily. Young doesn't lower his eyes like Stroud does. Stroud takes sacks while Young turns a negative into a positive. Stroud stays on his 1 receiver too long and doesn't go through his progressions quickly enough - meaning either slow processing or indecisiveness. A lot of these negatives are coachable.

Personally, I think I've actually talked myself into Young. I think I would take the injury risk. Barring career ending injury, I think Young will be an elite QB in the NFL. I think Stroud will possibly become an elite QB in the NFL.

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csx Grand Master

csx

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34 minutes ago, Luciu5 said:

I wouldn't say that. I've watched a bunch of both and to me Young can do things that Stroud either can't or won't. Some of the throws he makes, it's like you can't teach that. Full field reads. Not just one play, but all over his tape. Hardly any of that in Stroud's tape. Young is the clear cut number one QB in this draft without any question, if it wasn't for his size.

All that said, Stroud is no slouch and wouldn't mind him, but Young is the safer pick in a lot of respects, besides size. Stroud struggles with pressure, which Young just avoids it easily. Young doesn't lower his eyes like Stroud does. Stroud takes sacks while Young turns a negative into a positive. Stroud stays on his 1 receiver too long and doesn't go through his progressions quickly enough - meaning either slow processing or indecisiveness. A lot of these negatives are coachable.

Personally, I think I've actually talked myself into Young. I think I would take the injury risk. Barring career ending injury, I think Young will be an elite QB in the NFL. I think Stroud will possibly become an elite QB in the NFL.

You say clear cut without any question but that's obviously not true.  There's plenty of questions and they are reflected in the different preferences/rankings 

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therealmjl Grand Master

therealmjl

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Buckeye Homer said:

Not really.  CJ is a FAR more polished passer than Dak ever was.  

    Passing
Year School Conf Class Pos G Cmp Att Pct Yds Y/A AY/A TD Int Rate
Career Mississippi State         734 1169 62.8 9376 8.0 8.3 70 23 146.0
*2012 Mississippi State SEC FR QB 12 18 29 62.1 194 6.7 9.4 4 0 163.8
*2013 Mississippi State SEC FR QB 11 156 267 58.4 1940 7.3 6.8 10 7 126.6
*2014 Mississippi State SEC JR QB 13 244 396 61.6 3449 8.7 8.8 27 11 151.7
*2015 Mississippi State SEC SR QB 13 316 477 66.2 3793 8.0 8.7 29 5 151.0

 

Year School Conf Class Pos G Cmp Att Pct Yds Y/A AY/A TD Int Rate
Career Ohio State         575 830 69.3 8123 9.8 11.2 85 12 1
*2020 Ohio State Big Ten FR QB 1 0 0   0     0 0  
*2021 Ohio State Big Ten FR QB 12 317 441 71.9 4435 10.1 11.4 44 6 186.6
*2022 Ohio State Big Ten JR QB 13 258 389 66.3 3688 9.5 10.9 41 6 177.7

By just pulling out those stats you could say the same about Haskins(rip) or Fields - neither of which are/were/will be a better passer than Prescott

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amcoolio Veteran

amcoolio

Posted
Posted (edited)

I meant in terms of smooth collected passing and finding the open receiver with perfect mechanics, but not improvising much or scrambling. If you watch his tape, it looks like Dak Prescott's NFL tape.

 

I think Dak is CJ's floor. If he never improves, he will be as good as Dak Prescott. Which is not bad and a safe #1 pick, but you'd hope for more. Its up to our staff to get the most of him, by all accounts he seems coachable.

Edited by amcoolio
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