The Athletic: Insight to Brian Burns Contract

[Tbe]

4 hours ago, tukafan21 said:

We. Turned. Down. Two. Firsts.

Why is this so hard to figure out?

The second we did that and it was known, it meant we were going to have to overpay to keep him, we lost ALL negotiating power.

He has us over a barrel, just pay the man because keeping him on an overpay is better than losing him for nothing (wouldn’t even get a comp pick as we’d be flush with cap room that we’d use on another FA).

It doesn’t mean any of that. It just means we didn’t want to trade away our best and only pass rusher in the middle of the season. He still has the option to test the open market.

Also, future picks are valued less than picks for the current year. In terms of value, they really offered two 2nds and a 3rd.

[Untouchable]

6 minutes ago, CRA said:

Panthers aren't lowballing Burns at 23M a year.  

Reddick got 15 a year in a deal last year.  Von Miller got 20M a year in a deal last year. 

Von was 32 and Reddick was 27 with less sacks over his career. Burns is 25 and the last time a player that young with that many sacks hit the market it was Joey Bosa (27 mil/year) 3 years ago. Hard to see Burns going for less than that especially after Nick Bosa goes for somewhere north of 31 mil/year.

[Mage]

5 hours ago, tukafan21 said:

We. Turned. Down. Two. Firsts.

Why is this so hard to figure out?

The second we did that and it was known, it meant we were going to have to overpay to keep him, we lost ALL negotiating power.

Because a player doesn't give a crap about that.  To think Brian Burns would magically be willing to take less money if a team never tried to trade for him is dumb as hell.

Are you telling me you would accept 7 million less dollars per year if a team didn't try and trade for you?  How does that make financial sense to you? 

Some of you are so upset we didn't trade him that you are saying stuff that doesn't make any sense.  Again, no team has reportedly offered 2 1sts for Chris Jones, and yet he's still holding out.  It literally makes no difference to the player.  Burns was going to keep his eyes on the Nick Bosa situation regardless.

Edited September 5, 2023 by Mage

[therealmjl]

8 minutes ago, Mage said:

Because a player doesn't give a crap about that.  To think Brian Burns would magically be willing to take less money if a team never tried to trade for him is dumb as hell.

Are you telling me you would accept 7 million less dollars per year if a team didn't try and trade for you?  How does that make financial sense to you? 

Some of you are so upset we didn't trade him that you are saying stuff that doesn't make any sense.  Again, no team has reportedly offered 2 1sts for Chris Jones, and yet he's still holding out.  It literally makes no difference to the player.  Burns was going to keep his eyes on the Nick Bosa situation regardless.

his point is that we need to just pay him and get this over with...

[mrcompletely11]

14 minutes ago, therealmjl said:

his point is that we need to just pay him and get this over with...

that would be pretty irresponsible for fitt to just give him and pay him top dollar

[WhoKnows]

46 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

Von was 32 and Reddick was 27 with less sacks over his career. Burns is 25 and the last time a player that young with that many sacks hit the market it was Joey Bosa (27 mil/year) 3 years ago. Hard to see Burns going for less than that especially after Nick Bosa goes for somewhere north of 31 mil/year.

Maxx Crosby is a great comparison and actually had better stats and accolades than Burns. He got $23.5M per year for 4 years and signed it 1 year ago since he wasn’t a first round pick with a 5th year option. Since we turned down the two firsts and one second, we probably should have used that and got it in front of him when we turned down the trade. Waiting made it more expensive and unfortunately might turn it into a decision. 

[SmokinwithWilly]

25 minutes ago, Mage said:

Because a player doesn't give a crap about that.  To think Brian Burns would magically be willing to take less money if a team never tried to trade for him is dumb as hell.

Are you telling me you would accept 7 million less dollars per year if a team didn't try and trade for you?  How does that make financial sense to you? 

Some of you are so upset we didn't trade him that you are saying stuff that doesn't make any sense.  Again, no team has reportedly offered 2 1sts for Chris Jones, and yet he's still holding out.  It literally makes no difference to the player.  Burns was going to keep his eyes on the Nick Bosa situation regardless.

A team trying to trade sets the value. The Panthers value Burns more than 2 1sts and a 2nd. That's an all pro/DPOY type value at a high value position.That's elite level pay grade. That's the value the Panthers set when they refused the offer. 

If a team had only offered a 3rd and 5th for Burns, that offer doesn't really show a huge desire to acquire that player. Burns wouldn't be able to legitimately demand a Bosa type contract and not get laughed out of the room if that had been the offer the Panthers turned down. 

Every year players demand contracts for what they think they're worth and every year we see players sign for less than their own perceived value or are out of the league completely. Look no further than Nuke, Jacobs and Dalvin Cook this year. All signed for less than what they were asking for because the league dictated they weren't worth what they thought. 

 

[Untouchable]

13 minutes ago, WhoKnows said:

Maxx Crosby is a great comparison and actually had better stats and accolades than Burns. He got $23.5M per year for 4 years and signed it 1 year ago since he wasn’t a first round pick with a 5th year option. Since we turned down the two firsts and one second, we probably should have used that and got it in front of him when we turned down the trade. Waiting made it more expensive and unfortunately might turn it into a decision. 

Think Crosby has more pressures but Burns had 0.5 sack more.  But you're right it would have likely been right around Crosby's contract last year if the team had gotten out in front of the market and the production like the Raiders did.

Maybe the team waited or maybe Burns bet on himself but in the end he exceeded that contract this last year and now is about to have a new market to negotiate into.

[Castavar]

1 hour ago, Untouchable said:

Think Crosby has more pressures but Burns had 0.5 sack more.  But you're right it would have likely been right around Crosby's contract last year if the team had gotten out in front of the market and the production like the Raiders did.

Maybe the team waited or maybe Burns bet on himself but in the end he exceeded that contract this last year and now is about to have a new market to negotiate into.

And if we're being honest, I would 100% rather have Crosby. He dominated as a pass rusher, AND had a 82.5 run-defense grade that ranked third among qualifying edge defenders. I thinks it's actually amusing Burns thinks he deserve to be paid more than Crosby.

[NorthTryon]

19 hours ago, frankw said:

Fitterer is mismanaging this situation but if he makes that Burns trade with the Rams he's effectively submitted his resignation. 95% chance he's not here to even see the names called for those first rounders. No owner is going to give a GM who was involved in the Matt Rhule fiasco a free two seasons to wait around to see the results of a few lottery tickets that might not even be as valuable anymore when they are finally ready to be redeemed.

All they heard and continue to hear was 1st round picks. You getting too deep for them.

[Gerry Green]

Yes he is. No he's not. Yes he is. No he's not. God I love this place.

[DJ feed me moore]

5 year 125 Million with 100 million fully GTD. that should be the final take it or leave it offer.. and by leave it I mean we franchise tag you for 2 more years.

[MHS831]

Here is how I see it--I would rather have Crosby or Bosa than Burns.  Give Burns a deal with incentives that put him on their level--if he wants Bosa and Crosby money, give him the ability to earn it by using their stats as benchmarks that kick in incentives. 

[tukafan21]

7 hours ago, Mage said:

Because a player doesn't give a crap about that.  To think Brian Burns would magically be willing to take less money if a team never tried to trade for him is dumb as hell.

Are you telling me you would accept 7 million less dollars per year if a team didn't try and trade for you?  How does that make financial sense to you? 

Some of you are so upset we didn't trade him that you are saying stuff that doesn't make any sense.  Again, no team has reportedly offered 2 1sts for Chris Jones, and yet he's still holding out.  It literally makes no difference to the player.  Burns was going to keep his eyes on the Nick Bosa situation regardless.

Did you mean to quote someone else with this response?

Because I'm literally saying the Panthers should be the ones to bite the bullet and sign a deal they don't want to, not Burns.  The "we" I was referring to was clearly the team, not as if I was speaking for Burns.

My point was that once we turned that down, it was a clear signal to Burns that we would need to meet more at his end than the other, he knew he had the team screwed at that point.